New line of Festool products at Home Depot...

[marrt]

I've been trying to convince myself to buy Festool for some time and I just can't pull the trigger.  In a nut shell, I think they are way over priced due to their dealer network.  Don't get me wrong, I also think they are consistently the best designed portable power tool brand you can buy.  However, they are not twice as good as Bosch.  There are many examples where another product is as good or close enough:  Bosch jigsaws, Bosch sanders, Bosch portable drills, etc....  A new Bosch tool is often 1/2 (or less) the cost of a Festool because Bosch uses mass retailers and sells A LOT more volume. 

Originally, as an unknown brand in the US, Festool's current distribution strategy made a lot of sense.  And the Europeans always like specialty "shops" anyway because mass retailers were slow to develop in much of Europe.  However, now that the brand is known (several magazine reviews and lots of users), they could make a lot of money by introducing a sub-brand "powered by Festool technology" and lowering the price to "just" a 25% premium over Bosch (and Dewalt and the rest of the mainstream "professional" brands).  With Festool's current distribution, they have to pay the dealers a lot of margin (e.g., probably 40% on the tools and much more on the accessories).  However, by moving to mainstream distribution, they can significantly lower the margin (Home Depot usually can live with 20-25%) and provide the end user a better deal in order to drive volume.  Both Festool and the end user would win big if they took this approach.  I respect the dealers who were pioneers and carried the Festool brand initially.  However, Festool products include a lot of safety features and innovation that more people should be able to afford and enjoy.  End of Rant.

 

[Amateur]

I believe that Festool would become "just another powertool" if they went to the mass merchants. Yes, some of their tools are over priced, but that is something that Festool has to resolve internally.
Another German company, Stihl, refuses to lower their quality and abandon the independent servicing dealer, they are #1 in their field and their tools are GREAT.

 

[fscraftsman]

Every tool I have seen in home despo lacks some form of quality compared to the same models that i have sold at dealerships or used as a craftsman and I can not or would want to see festool change there standers to fit in the box stores who have poor quality not only in there materials products and employe knowlage

 

[Frank Pellow]

I very strongly encourage Festool not to do what you have suggested.

 

[mastercabman]

We have enough crap as it is,i don't think it's a good idea for Festool to come up with a down grade power tool so that they can compete with the other.

 

[marrt]

We have enough crap as it is,i don't think it's a good idea for Festool to come up with a down grade power tool so that they can compete with the other.

No where did I suggest they sell crap.  They should NOT do what John Deere did with lawn mowers, or Husqvarna, or, now apparently, Porter Cable at Lowes.  This is called "harvesting the brand"...basically using the brand's good name and reputation to sell crap.  This is some Marketing guy's "big idea" on how to make some fast money.  What I'm talking about is selling good products with innovative and safety features to more consumers.  Today, Festool is Lexus.  However, there's nothing to stop them from introducing a Toyota brand (I assume everyone knows that Lexus and Toyota are the same company).  I doubt anyone would argue that Toyota makes great cars for the money.

 

[nickao]

The Festools are not going to sell at a big box store at the current prices, IMHO. Therefore I do not believe they would ever become just another tool brand and so what if they did. As long as the tools are good. I think the high price will stop that from ever happening and the only way HD would take the tool line is if they could offer a huge discount of some kind. They can't so why would they get involved in it. I do not see it as a big seller at a HD. I could see people laughing at the prices in the aisles.

I do not agree with the tools at Home depot being any different form a dealer network. That's wrong. The Milwaukee Slider is the same exact  tool, the Bosch routers are the exact same tool, etc. Only the service is different, the tools are the same and not specially made for HD to a different standard. Not any I have ever purchased there.

Yes, some of the Festools are overpriced, other Festools are worth the price because of the particular tools uniqueness and effectiveness.

If the quality stayed the same. If the price came down. If the Festools at HD were identical in every way to the current Festools but cheaper. If festool stayed committed to the tools and never changed and kept on track in improving like they are now, what possible reason could someone have for not wanting it to happen?

Some say well the quality could get worse. I am suggesting what if it was 100% for sure the  quality would not taper and the Festool company would be no different and just as good. I propose many would still not want it to happen, but why?

I think a lot of a resistance from current Festools users  NOT wanting the tools in a big box store is that the Festool guys(current users) like the fact it is more of a close knit group of users and the Festool users do not want everyone joining in and making it a common thing. Many have admitted they want the Festools to stay unknown and expensive so they can have a benefit over competition and keep the "handy man" from purchasing them. Festools have a sexiness or mystic about them. I think people do not want that aura of the Festools sexiness and uniqueness changing, which selling at HD would probably do.

Other than the tools changing quality as I mentioned or that going in HD may stifle the leading edge technology Festool usually presents, why would this not be a good thing?

I have no opinion either way, I am just asking. I am happy the way it is and buy everything online anyway. 

PS I think making a lower quality line of Festools just for HD would be a HUGE mistake for many reasons!

 

[mastercabman]

We have enough crap as it is,i don't think it's a good idea for Festool to come up with a down grade power tool so that they can compete with the other.

No where did I suggest they sell crap.  They should NOT do what John Deere did with lawn mowers, or Husqvarna, or, now apparently, Porter Cable at Lowes.  This is called "harvesting the brand"...basically using the brand's good name and reputation to sell crap.  This is some Marketing guy's "big idea" on how to make some fast money.  What I'm talking about is selling good products with innovative and safety features to more consumers.  Today, Festool is Lexus.  However, there's nothing to stop them from introducing a Toyota brand (I assume everyone knows that Lexus and Toyota are the same company).  I doubt anyone would argue that Toyota makes great cars for the money.

I understand what your are saying,
It would need a bigger market for them to introduce there tools in a store like that,and they would need to be competitive with there price,if not they will never make it.
Home depot/Lowes have only one thing in mind,that is to sell,sell,sell  and if a product does not do good,  they 're not going to bother with it.
Festool is not made in China!  That's also another reason why it is expensive
Yes,Lexus is owned by Toyota,but there's a difference in price.That's why you see more Toyota than Lexus.

 

[WarnerConstCo.]

If they showed up at Blowes or the Despair, I think I would move on.  And yes there are some different lines of tools that are different than the supply house or hardware store tools.  Most are in the pnuematic caragory.  Festool at HD?  I would feel dirty.

 

[herbsandspices]

I believe that Festool would become "just another powertool" if they went to the mass merchants.

+1 - they'd probably end up outsourcing their manufacturing to China, possibly losing sight of their rigid QC.

And the Festool Owners Group would turn into a place where you'd go to find the cheapest tool, not the best tool.

All that being said, if they wanna lower prices, I'm all for it! ;D

john

 

[bill-e]

While I'd love to be able to afford a Kapex, I believe that if Festool tried to compete at big box type stores by lowering margins and increasing volume, the end result would be at best, German designed tools made in China and at worst, Festool "Shopmaster"-like tools.

Virtually none of the tools sold via chain stores are of the quality that they used to be and that is because they are not competing on quality and service, but simply on price....The "Walmartization" of America.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[nickao]

We have nothing to fear.

Festools current business plan does not seem to be dependent upon price matching, lowering prices, or making cheaper tools, etc.

There are plenty of lower end tool companies already why would they even want to try and compete in the low end market. Festools  niche is high end, high quality, high price.

 

[chrisrosenb]

One of the things that sold me on Festool was that I can buy any accessory in the Festool catalog, from any dealer & have it in a few days.
Try doing that on accessories for the other brands at the Big Box Stores.   

 

[robtonya]

One of the things that sold me on Festool was that I can buy any accessory in the Festool catalog, from any dealer & have it in a few days.
Try doing that on accessories for the other brands at the Big Box Stores.   

and at the same price too. I don't have to shop around for the best deal.

 

[marrt]

and at the same price too. I don't have to shop around for the best deal.

Yeah, also known as...Price Fixing.  Something that is usually illegal in the US (but not in Europe). 

Festool is not made in China!

Nether are many Bosch tools.  Many are made is Switzerland.  If you have a good tool, then you will get enough volume to be competitive.

If they showed up at Blowes or the Despair, I think I would move on.

To what?...as far as I know, there's only one Festool.  Meaning, a company that a) brings unique features to almost every product, b) has outstanding dust control c) is designed as a system and d) charges 3X more than everyone else for the privilege.

Keep in mind guys...I really like Festool.  I just don't think they have to be reserved only to those willing (and proud) to pay 3x.  There's no reason why even the "common man" shouldn't by able to afford the safety and innovation of Festool.  We're talking about a POWER TOOL here...not the cure for cancer.  These things don't cost that much to manufacture in quantity.  The money is in the R&D.  Why wait until the patents expire and DeWalt or the Chinese copies the design and reap most of the benefit (heck, the patent doesn't even have to expire for the Chinese copy you).  Now, before you say it, I know the DeWalt plunge saw is almost as expensive as the Festool.  However, let's compare prices in 12 to 18 months and see if there's a difference.  Want to wager on it? 

 

[Ken Milhinch]

Perhaps instead of Festool lowering their standards to compete with Bosch et al, perhaps they could all try to raise their standards to meet Festool 
I am also puzzled how you can judge Bosch or others to be as good as Festool when you don't have any Festool products  :

 

[nickao]

Well I can verify the Bosch 1250 sander and the Bosch Jigsaw are just as good as the Festool Rotex and Festool Jig and I have the Festools.

 

[nickao]

You know guys I am tired of hearing about China.

Its the Tool company that allows the Chinese to give them the products this quality and then the company that buys the tools from the Chinese and the company that than sells us the tools.

If the tool companies demanded better or pulled their business the Chinese would give them better tools. It's not like the Chinese are ripping the companies off and not building the tools to their specs. They are building the tools to the specs, the companies are getting what they are paying for. I know I have a Craftsman saw made in  China and I have been torturing it for 4 years and it is still like new. Craftsman demanded certain specifications and got it.

Even in China you get what you pay for.

I do not blame the Chinese for this quality issue. I blame the companies that actually go ahead and sub out the work to the Chinese companies and then sell us sub standard tools knowing about  these quality issues.

 

[peter halle]

Festool has a business model that works for them.  They control their own destiny throughout the process.  Once you get a big box store involved then pressures can be applied that are counter productive to their model.

Not as a slam to anyone here, but it amazes me that we want to be able to get things cheaper and cheaper knowing full well that the raw products are getting more expensive and then hope that our incomes will also increase.  If the big box stores are involved, the quality will go down.

I personally shop for products based on a different set of parameters than many - value is more important to me than price.

 

[Tinker]

I've said this, based on experience, many times thru the years.  If you were to search thru my many posts within this forum, you will probably see it mentioned upon many occasions. "CHEAP AIN'T CHEAP"
You buy cheap and you will soon by fixin' or replacin'.
Tinker